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Hand Controlled Pivot- Thesis

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  #21  
Old 02-21-2005, 02:16 AM
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I feel the turning of the right hip and power package starting the backswing at the same time ..............
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  #22  
Old 03-04-2005, 05:50 PM
pluthb pluthb is offline
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More insight on learning
From what I've read and observed, the golf swing takes 0.8-1.2 seconds from start to impact. It takes 1/3 of a second for your hands to send your brain what they are sensing, 1/4 second for the brain to interpret the information and another 1/3 of a second for your brain to send information back to your hands. Can you really change your swing with effectiveness if your thoughts are in the transition or downswing? I don't think so but I may be wrong.

I think Homer knew what he was talking about when he said to be as prepared as possible at Address, deliberate as possible to the top and smooth as possible through to the Finish.

Look forward to hearing your thoughts.
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  #23  
Old 03-04-2005, 10:36 PM
Golfie McG Golfie McG is offline
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Re: More insight on learning
Originally Posted by pluthb
From what I've read and observed, the golf swing takes 0.8-1.2 seconds from start to impact. It takes 1/3 of a second for your hands to send your brain what they are sensing, 1/4 second for the brain to interpret the information and another 1/3 of a second for your brain to send information back to your hands. ....
Kills me when Tiger says that he gets stuck and "saves it" as if he gets halfway down, realizes and save it. Proably the "get stuck and save it" pattern is triggered no later than the End and perhaps sooner.

Golfie
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  #24  
Old 03-06-2005, 02:29 PM
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Re: More insight on learning
Originally Posted by pluthb
From what I've read and observed, the golf swing takes 0.8-1.2 seconds from start to impact. It takes 1/3 of a second for your hands to send your brain what they are sensing, 1/4 second for the brain to interpret the information and another 1/3 of a second for your brain to send information back to your hands. Can you really change your swing with effectiveness if your thoughts are in the transition or downswing? I don't think so but I may be wrong.

I think Homer knew what he was talking about when he said to be as prepared as possible at Address, deliberate as possible to the top and smooth as possible through to the Finish.

Look forward to hearing your thoughts.
Your post would be a great source for a 3 page or X page written thesis or discussion on the implications of the delay in sensing and then reacting to nerve impulses, but without really any thought put into it, the above is "pseudo - science" at best and all non-thinkers should jump on board!

What your saying/implying is that the golf swing takes between .8-1.2 seconds from start-up to impact. Then your saying that by the time you have a sensation, interpret that sensation and then make an adjustment for it that get's back to your hands, it would take .916 seconds (11/12). So from a sensation at start-up for many players (those from .8 seconds to .916 seconds), they could do nothing to adjust for it before impact. Forget about downstroke blackout, try backstroke and downstroke blackout!

Also, the statement doesn't account for goal orientation- what your planning to do, etc.

Without covering all the possible valid conclusions that could be made, one example of how you might use this information would be as follows:
(Note, I am not using your time frames- because practically speaking I think the nerve speed is faster than what you have quoted or need to be defined in a different context, so I am just giving a general example below.)
Because of the time lapse between what your sensing and what is actually happening- you will feel things after they have already happened. So let's look at clubhead thowaway and the pre impact/impact release motions/feels. To get the proper feel of impact- would require that you have the feel at impact of somepoint prior to impact. Impact would feel alot more down or delayed release than you would think it would need to be because of the time delay of the nerve impulses. What you feel at impact is really where you want to be say a few feet before impact. That might explain why so many people throw the club early.

Also, in that regard if you posed your impact fix and got the feel of what it felt like - that wouldn't be the proper feel for impact. Because with the speed of the downswing- again you would have to try to duplicate the feel of impact - with a feel that was before impact based on the delay in nerve impulses.

So I believe there are some real practical issues that you could learn from your statement regarding delays in sensing sensations, but to take your statement and jump to the conclusion that nothing matters after the top- well that makes me crazy, without further defining the issues you've done a real injustice to the facts. From a practical perspective you also need to differentiate what's happening and what the player is sensing/ feeling/ using to make the movement. Anotherwords, even if what you said is true, you still as a player will sense correction into the downswing as a result of the delayed nerve response and you can use that information for your benefit as I described above.

In summary- there may be alot of guys that agree with your statement but as a player and realizing all the sensations that I use to hit a golf shot, I find it insulting - the implied intent that after the start of the downswing- nothing matters (assuming that's what your statement is saying).

Now that I vented- who knows you might prove me wrong but we need to elaborate on the implications of your comment to see what real validity and practical applications it may point out.

Mike O.
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  #25  
Old 03-06-2005, 04:06 PM
Golfie McG Golfie McG is offline
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Test for yourself!
Here's a test that you can do. The DS takes about .25 sec. See if you can beat that time consistently. Report back.

http://faculty.washington.edu/chudle...reacttime.html

... and remember this test takes input through the eyes as opposed to having to travel through neurons electrically and across synapses chemically.... Your results here will be better than you could do in a golf swing.


My take is that intention beats reaction.

Golfie
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  #26  
Old 03-07-2005, 03:39 PM
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Re: Test for yourself!
Originally Posted by Golfie McG
Here's a test that you can do. The DS takes about .25 sec. See if you can beat that time consistently. Report back.

http://faculty.washington.edu/chudle...reacttime.html

... and remember this test takes input through the eyes as opposed to having to travel through neurons electrically and across synapses chemically.... Your results here will be better than you could do in a golf swing.


My take is that intention beats reaction.

Golfie
Here's another one that works with Internet Explorer:

http://www.topendsports.com/testing/reactiontest.htm
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  #27  
Old 03-07-2005, 05:26 PM
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Thanks for the new link- as I do have Internet Explorer.
I was .34 seconds.
Golfie, I agree that intention is more critical in this context than reaction time. I still think that if someone had the interest - this issue of reaction time certainly could provide some important learning/instruction concepts. I just don't like it in regard to any implied thought that ANYTHING after the start down is not important due to the above post.

My .34 seconds would include seeing the background, the travel of those neural impulses to my brain, the brain's acknowledgement, and then the neural impulses out to my index finger, then the travel time of the key hit to the computer. Which all is much quicker than the .91 seconds (11/12)listed in the above post.

Mike O.
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  #28  
Old 03-07-2005, 06:02 PM
Matt Matt is offline
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Best I got on that was 0.203
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  #29  
Old 03-07-2005, 06:34 PM
phillygolf phillygolf is offline
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Is 9 seconds too long?
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  #30  
Old 03-07-2005, 06:49 PM
mgjordan mgjordan is offline
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