Please post Pivot Drills that others may not be aware of. Upload pictures if possible.
The following are the McDonald Pivot Drills.
I recommend that "Exercise #2 and #4" be performed with the club behind the back and through the elbows. I don't recommend #10 and 11 because they promote a roundish Pivot. That may be ok for an Elbow Plane Swinger but not a TSP Swinger or Hitter.
Quote:
POWER PACKAGE TRANSPORT
7-12 PIVOT The Pivot is the utilization of multiple centers to produce a circular motion for generating Clubhead Force on an adjustable Plane. Plus the maintenance of balance throughout the weight shifts that accompany the turning and bending of the necessary for the two Line Delivery Paths. A Pivot is on superficially correct that fails to maintain alignments or allows the player to get “out of position”.
It is the massive vehicle which transports the Power Package Assembly to the launching pad and back-up support for the Hitters driving Right Arm (6-B-1). It is the massive rotor, supplying Angular Momentum for the Throw Out power transfer to the Swinger’s orbiting Left Arm (6-B-3).
It is the sequencing and spacing of Zone #1 Stroke Components. It consists of – as separate and distinct elements – the motions and actions of the Shoulders, Hips, Knees and Feet. The term Pivot is relative in that it can be classified as anything between Full motion and Zero motion and may include all, part or none of the possible Component Motions and actions. It defines their participation (6-M-1) including the requirements of Plane Angle and Stance Line Variations (10-12, 10-15-0). It is Zone #1, the first and foundational of the three Zones in Chapter 9. Study 2-0, 9-0 and items 1 and 2 under Sketch 1-L.
As Stroke Component, the term PIVOT refers only to the degree and direction of its own motion as the framework or pattern within which all the Pivot Components must be arranged and adjusted. The relative participation of the individual Pivot Components is always determined under their own Pattern references. ALL motion – Pivot and Power Package – moves parallel to the selected Delivery Line. That is, prior to the Downstroke Turn, a Slide parallel with either the Angle of Approach or the Plane line per 2-J-3.
Quote:
DUAL AGENT
7-13 SHOULDER TURN The Shoulder Turn Component is controlled by establishing the Planes on which the Right Shoulder can be rotated – which is in turn dictated by the Hip Turn Component. The Shoulder is the fastest and farthest moving component of the Pivot and actually transmits the Pivot motion to the Arms. Study 2-H. So, being part of the Power Package, its motion does not necessarily violate Zero Pivot requirement.
When the Shoulder moves on the same Downstroke Plane as the Hands it provides the greatest support and its best guidance to the Stroke.
However, it can also turn “Off Plane” and still impart rotation, and it can turn not at all and assign this function to the swinging Left Arm. But the Arms will always seek to move to – and on – the Plane of the Shoulder Turn, requiring compensation by Pressure Point #3 per 2-L#2 and 10-11-0-3. This, with inadequate Backstroke Shoulder Turn and/or inadequate Downstroke Shoulder Lag, will always produce an “Outside-In” Impact, with its stifling of the Clubhead orbit (4-D-0). Keep that Right Shoulder not only “back” but also “down” (On Plane), or you will “run out of Right Arm” before the Hands reach Impact Position – an automatic Throwaway (7-14, 8-6).
Incidentally, with Zero Accumulator #3 there is a theoretically a Left Shoulder Inclined Plane Angle. Therefore, being synonymous terms, it is far better to consider it as Zero Accumulator #3. See 6-B-3-B.
nice to get these together in a handy to print format - thanks D
__________________ The student senses his teacher’s steadfast belief and quiet resolve: “This is doable. It is doable by you. The pathway is there. All you need is determination and time.” And together, they make it happen.
Paul Bertholy and Bob MacDonald's Blast From the Past
Daryl,
Thanks for cleaning up and posting these Bob MacDonald images. I sincerely appreciate it!
Bambam, let's put these in a prominent place in our Gallery. Thanks!
P.S. Interested readers should know that, in the spring of 1982, Paul Bertholy, then 80-something years young and one of the most esteemed PGA of America teachers, gave me his personal copy of Bob MacDonald's 1927 book, Golf. At the conclusion of our two-day training session at his home at Foxfire in Pinehurst, NC, he motioned me out of the front room to a nearby closet. He opened the door, rambled around for a minute or so, and emerged with Bob's book, the same one he had referenced several times in our study. He then offered it up in both hands and said, "I want you to have this."
Thanks for these posts Daryl, and I have a question.
Originally Posted by Daryl
Please post Pivot Drills that others may not be aware of. Upload pictures if possible.
The following are the McDonald Pivot Drills.
I recommend that "Exercise #2 and #4" be performed with the club behind the back and through the elbows. I don't recommend #10 and 11 because they promote a roundish Pivot. That may be ok for an Elbow Plane Swinger but not a TSP Swinger or Hitter.
It seems in reviewing these exercises, Daryl, that it is possible to lose ( ex. # 11) the "belly-button-handle synchronization." When I do ex. # 2, my back shoulder easily flows all the way back and very far away from the RFT line. Does the depth of the full turn of the back shoulder, driven or invited by my back hip, mandate a certain downswing? Is that where the "out to right field" strike starts from?
It seems to my apprentice padowin gifts that a deep turn needs a deep pp# 4 response with angle hinge to avoid hooking the ball. The # 4 feels UP inviting the back shoulder DOWN then OUT and always FORWARD . It seems like doing ex. # 11 by keying on the belly button is an invitation to OTT land.
In another post of yours I read this evening, you mentioned bending and unbending the back elbow. Am I understanding you to suggest that while turning the hip back, additional elbow bend will make the turn back even deeper (ex. 4) and that the downswing pivot can be at any speed as long as the belly button is ahead of the extended elbow? The combination of the pivot leading the elbow extension negating hooks and adding power?
Is that what hitters do? Reverse and beast the ball with the elbow unbending? There is a lot of power there. Is that why they need aimpoints? With such a deep shoulder turn, I could drive my primary lever very hard as long as I kept the clubface/head on the baseline of the plane, but allowing that club to go so deep with the back shoulder is "hook madness, " unless I drove the lever down to my back heel with an open face.
Or am I just bleary-eyed?
Patrick
__________________
HP, grant me the serenity to accept what I cannot change, the courage to change what I can, and the wisdom to know the difference. Progress and not perfection is the goal every day!
Last edited by innercityteacher : 07-23-2010 at 01:01 AM.
It seems in reviewing these exercises, Daryl, that it is possible to lose ( ex. # 11) the "belly-button-handle synchronization."
Thank goodness! Your goal is an On-Plane Clubshaft. Does the Plane Align with your belly-button?
When I do ex. # 2, my back shoulder easily flows all the way back and very far away from the RFT line.
Are you purposefully trying to swing on the Elbow Plane? Did you read my advice that said in "Exercise #2 and 4, put the Club behind your back"? Please put the club behind your back and try the exercise again. The right shoulder should not feel like its going "all the way back and very far away from the RFT line". Do this exercise with a "Stationary Head" and the club behind your back.
Does the depth of the full turn of the back shoulder, driven or invited by my back hip, mandate a certain downswing? Is that where the "out to right field" strike starts from?
This is a problem. It's not "so much" that your hips are controlling the shoulder turn but the way you turn your hips. There's no doubt that you have the right shoulder going way too far back and flat if you allow "turning hips" to direct them because that motion takes you off-plane. This is a sure way to make the clubhead go out to right field and rise above plane at and after impact.
Going out to right field is the "out" feel of the Downstroke. It is not intended for your shaft and clubhead to literally go to right field (Rise above the plane) at impact and follow-through. You must stay on-plane for a three dimensional impact. Use a Laser. I have a "Smart Stick Laser" that I use and I can "Rip" it through the Impact interval and I'm perfectly On-Plane but if I Turn too deep on the backstroke, like you, then the Laser goes to Right Field. That's not good and Impact is not a good time to use compensations.
It seems to my apprentice padowin gifts that a deep turn needs a deep pp# 4 response with angle hinge to avoid hooking the ball. The # 4 feels UP inviting the back shoulder DOWN then OUT and always FORWARD . It seems like doing ex. # 11 by keying on the belly button is an invitation to OTT land.
Did you read my advice at the beginning of the post? It says "I do not recommend #10 or 11 because they promote a roundish pivot". And, unless you want to swing on the Elbow Plane or out to right field, avoid them "like the Plague".
In another post of yours I read this evening, you mentioned bending and unbending the back elbow. Am I understanding you to suggest that while turning the hip back, additional elbow bend will make the turn back even deeper (ex. 4) and that the downswing pivot can be at any speed as long as the belly button is ahead of the extended elbow? The combination of the pivot leading the elbow extension negating hooks and adding power?
If you rotate your hips around to turn them, then your right shoulder will go very deep and too flat and throw everything off plane. Please refer to exercise #5 and 6. March in-place while you swing your arms and you will learn the KEY to swinging on the TSP and how the Pivot can be aligned to automatically move the right shoulder On-Plane/Down-Plane every time without any effort. Keep the balls of your feet on the ground and lift your heels as you march. Experiment by exaggerating the "march" for you to feel that the Hips and Shoulders move differently but are synchronized. Don't pull the arms down, let the pivot do that. Notice that your Hips move in an alternating pattern from front to back and back to front while your shoulders move kind of up and down.
Please notice that your hips turn, but you aren't rotating them. The bending and straightening knees allow the turn.
HK said that if you can't get the right shoulder back to the plane during the backstroke, then use a steeper plane. In other words, use a TSP. Normal people don't have a problem getting the shoulder back to the Turned Shoulder Plane because it isn't very Far Back. In fact, from the deep shoulder turn you've become accustomed too, it will feel barely back at all.
Is that what hitters do? Reverse and beast the ball with the elbow unbending? There is a lot of power there. Is that why they need aimpoints? With such a deep shoulder turn, I could drive my primary lever very hard as long as I kept the clubface/head on the baseline of the plane, but allowing that club to go so deep with the back shoulder is "hook madness, " unless I drove the lever down to my back heel with an open face.
Thanks for cleaning up and posting these Bob MacDonald images. I sincerely appreciate it!
Bambam, let's put these in a prominent place in our Gallery. Thanks!
P.S. Interested readers should know that, in the spring of 1982, Paul Bertholy, then 80-something years young and one of the most esteemed PGA of America teachers, gave me his personal copy of Bob MacDonald's 1927 book, Golf. At the conclusion of our two-day training session at his home at Foxfire in Pinehurst, NC, he motioned me out of the front room to a nearby closet. He opened the door, rambled around for a minute or so, and emerged with Bob's book, the same one he had referenced several times in our study. He then offered it up in both hands and said, "I want you to have this."
Sorry . . . I just bought this one (my third!). Keep your searches working, and you'll soon find your own.
Lynnard . . . you still got your lead pipe? Mr. Bertholy was a TASKMASTER. I went to see him just before he died. I had just purchased the Machine . . . tried to read it . . . didn't get it . . . looked up golf skools on the intreenet and Mr. Bertholy's said he could make you swing like Hogan. So I decided I'd better go see him . . . pretty interesting stuff . . . and man his wife could make a good chicken salad samich. I remember him karate chopping wiffle balls to make them spin on a lunch table and popping you with pencils to illustrate #2 throw out snappy releaseeez.
I like exercises 10 and 11 personally. I see your objections, but think the exercises to be primarily body drills, Zone 1 and really more for the backswing than the downswing. The downswing for full shots normally having some Hip Slide , Axis Tilt as well as some lag to the Arms trailing the Body.
Per 7-12 the Pivot is a massive rotor that sets up the gyroscopic nature of the golf swing. In an actual golf swing, the Hands at about the position illustrated in exercise 11 appear to have Turned but they are still vertical to the Horizontal plane , the ground assuming, Horizontal Hinging. Most guys actually turn the forearms independently and often with a stalled Pivot, no clearing of the Right Hip and hence Mr Macdonalds drill number 10 and 11. The Forearms are Turned per say, but not independently! The Pivot can do much of it. Arm travel and forearm turn on the backswing are not as big as you would assume when isolated!
The first few inches of my swing feel exactly like exercise 10. Is this Pivot to Hands? Yes, briefly I guess, for me anyways. I feel like my turning right hip starts the club back on its journey. It goes really well with a Lagging Takeaway. As soon as I start to Right Forearm Pickup and Trace (1-L-6) the Hands are going Up as well as Back and In. And thereby on plane. Three dimensional Start Up. Lynn says the Hands can start Up right off the start though if you wish. You have to get into the Divergent Vectors of the Pivot and Arms to get this fully.
In short if you add a Right Forearm Pickup and 1-L-6 to Macdonald drill number 10 you've got Hands to Pivot and whatever plane angle you want. TSP or otherwise. Like you I prefer the TSP.
Doing just as illustrated in drills 10 and 11 would be Pivot to Hands and non planar for sure. But the body as rotor , Zone 1 is still critical to the golf swing. Hence the drill. Its a pure turn on an axis with no head Bob or Sway. Its sort of like how the 1-L machine without a second hinge pin would describe a cone shaped, non planar, Single Horizontal motion. Hence the second hinge pin, hence Dual Horizontal. The second Hinge Pin is not in the PIvot! The Pivot does not dictate the Plane Angle unless you are Pivot to Hands! Which would require a precise amount of waist bend to achieve a usable Plane Angle without a compensation of some sort.
I dunno. I've got a few videos of Lynn covering off these drills number 10 and 11 and a few other PIvot drills. Ill ask him if he would mind me putting them up on Youtube for all to see.
P.S. Interested readers should know that, in the spring of 1982, Paul Bertholy, then 80-something years young and one of the most esteemed PGA of America teachers, gave me his personal copy of Bob MacDonald's 1927 book, Golf. At the conclusion of our two-day training session at his home at Foxfire in Pinehurst, NC, he motioned me out of the front room to a nearby closet. He opened the door, rambled around for a minute or so, and emerged with Bob's book, the same one he had referenced several times in our study. He then offered it up in both hands and said, "I want you to have this."
I was grateful, but dumbfounded:
Why would he give away such a prized possession?
And why to me?
Only now am I starting to get the idea.
Lynn, sorry for the thread jack but this seems the right moment.........would you care to contrast Mr Bertholy's "Rod and Claw" with Homer's inert left arm and Extensor Action?
You, again, seem uniquely placed to give the ultimate description of both methodologies and so I must ask. Rod vs String so to speak. They both have merit to my mind.
Regards.
P.S. My apologies to Daryl for taking this great thread into Zone 2.
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